Posted by Marcia on August 09, 1998 at 21:50:23:
In Reply to: Re: More on Magua posted by Kay on August 09, 1998 at 19:49:38:
Hi, Kay...just to go over a couple of points here:
: : Kay, I can tell you why *I* consider Magua evil, and I'll use your example to try to make my point. You bet if someone killed my children I would want to be sure they did NOT go unpunished! If I thought I could get away with it, I would probably try to do them in MYSELF. But I would like to think I would stop when I had finished with the guilty party, and would not feel it necessary to kill THIS person's innocent children, and every other member of his race, to boot.
: I know that Magua wanted to kill Munro's children,but the fact
: is that he didn't.In fact,he was trying to get Alice to come away from the edge of the cliff.If he really wanted her dead,he would have given her a little shove,not hold out his hand to her.
Ah, but for what purpose? I believe he had every intention of taking her to the Hurons on the Lake and sacrificing her there. After all, he said, more than once, he wanted Munro's seed wiped out forever...back to his wanting to kill innocent children, isn't it? And what about his acknowledging that he would gladly kill every man, woman & child of his enemies? Or that he would use the ways of the White Man to trick the Sauk, Seneca & Fox? And then turn himself into the very people he hates, just to be better at their game than they are? That isn't only evil, it's sick.
I wrote before:
: : You said yourself killing children is EVIL. Because an evil has happened to you, does it make you less evil to perpetrate that crime? I don't think so. And when Magua says "The Grey Hair was the father of all of that," he may have been speaking figuratively. I've never been so sure that Munro, himself, WAS responsible for those particular crimes. At least, not any more so than the White Man, in general. But again, even if he personally killed each and everyone of Magua's children, why does that make it ok for Magua's vengence to extend beyond Munro to include his daughters who had nothing to do with the killing?
: Marcia,I don't think that Munro did the actual killing,but I do think that he was in charge of the men that did kill them.
As I said, even if Munro was personally responsible, why should his *children* pay for his crimes, if not to satisfy Magua's twisted heart?
I wrote before:
: : And why does Magua want to turn himself into the very people he is so full of hatred for? And why is he willing to bring down the wrath of the Yengeese on his own tribe, just to satisfy his personal anger? And why does the Sachem make it clear that Magua's way is not the Huron way? Because Magua's heart is twisted with hate, that's why. And a heart twisted with hate can be nothing but EVIL, no matter the cause.
: The Sachem didn't think that Magua's ways were the ways of the Huron's,but even the Sachem thought that Cora should die in the fire to avenge the death's of Magua's children.Would you call the Sachem evil too?
The Sachem did not want to wipe out Munro's seed forever...he wanted Magua to take Alice as his wife to make sure that Munro's seed was NOT wiped out. He wanted to send the Yengeese soldier back to the English so that their hatred would burn less bright. And he wanted one person to die to make Magua feel avenged. Magua wanted all three prisoners to die. The Sachem was trying to come up with a solution that would appease everyone, and his suggestion was certainly less drastic than Magua's.
I wrote before:
: : Now, I personally feel a great sorrow for the Native peoples who were treated so badly by the Europeans. I think there were more injustices done than can be named here. But there are evil men on every continent and amongst every race, and the fact that Magua belonged to a people who were being brutally displaced does not make him any less evil.
: I agree that there are a lot of evil people in this world,but I think that we are just going to have to agree to disagree about
: Magua's evilness.
That may be, but I still say a heart twisted with hatred is the very essence of evil.
I wrote before:
: : Once again, a heart filled with vengence and hatred and bent on rising to the top of the power chain by being the most vicious of them all is an EVIL heart. Pure and simple.
: Now Marcia,you of all people should know that nothing about LOTM is pure and simple:o)
And there you have me...a true statement if I ever heard one. But simple or not, I'll still stick to my firm belief that Magua is the villain in this piece, Hawkeye, Uncas & Chingachgook are the heroes, Duncan is brave though misguided, and Cora & Alice are the heroines, (one strong, one weak, each lovable in her own way). You asked why we felt that Magua was evil, and I've explained to the best of my abilities, and as you say, we'll just have to agree to disagree, I reckon.
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