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Highlander
Colonial Militia
USA
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February 04 2003
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 Posted - February 10 2004 : 05:45:22 AM
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Did President Bush go to war without solid evidence of a threat? As questions about the integrity of the case for attacking Iraq escalate,so do questions about Bush's own credibility.I can't see how Bush was able to sell the people a false bill of goods about this looming threat that Sadaam Hussein supposedly represented. After all,we're talking about a country whose military we decimated in the first Gulf War. They were also under U.N.sanctions for a dozen or so years as well.It came out in one of my hearings with the VA that Ronnie Raygun gave Saddam much of his WMDs that were supplied by American companies.There was certainly no outcry from the U.S. when Saddam used them on the Kurds in the late 1980's. It seems as if GWs reasons for going to war change daily since no WMDs have been found.The least of which is his own ego.Would any of you guys send one of your loved ones to fight in this war under such shakey circumstances?
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SgtMunro
Soldier of the King
USA
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September 23 2002
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 Posted - February 10 2004 : 08:35:08 AM
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Well Captain, before I go into this, please allow me first to properly prepare myself. (Sarge takes a minute to change into his toga, complete with the trim of an honorably retired legionaire. Placing a simple laurel about his head, and takes his place in the 'speakers corner', with the Coliseum in the background.)
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Did President Bush go to war without solid evidence of a threat?
I believe the quote was, and I might be a word or two off, "...a developing threat, which could become imminent."
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As questions about the integrity of the case for attacking Iraq escalate,so do questions about Bush's own credibility.
So does that of former President Clinton (declared Iraq a threat in 1998 & 2000), the Unitied Nations Security Council (declared Iraq a threat in 1998) and the United Nation's Secretary General Kofi Annon (agreed with the security council's findings in 1999).
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I can't see how Bush was able to sell the people a false bill of goods about this looming threat that Sadaam Hussein supposedly represented.
Sounds like he operated under the intellegence that he was given by our own CIA/DIA assests (still in the rebuilding phase, after being decimated in the 1970's by the opposition, and further smashed by an Executive order in the 1990's. You cannot get good HumInt sources overnight.) Our "faulty" intellegence was cooborated by the Brits, Israelis, and U.N. Inspectors.
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They were also under U.N.sanctions for a dozen or so years as well.It came out in one of my hearings with the VA that Ronnie Raygun gave Saddam much of his WMDs that were supplied by American companies.There was certainly no outcry from the U.S. when Saddam used them on the Kurds in the late 1980's.
He also possesed Russian Sarin Gas, used on the Iranians during that same time. There was no outcry from the masses, because there was no one outside of Langley, The Pentagon or Foggy Bottom who knew of the attacks on the Kurds, at that time. Also, looking strategically, the Iraqis were keeping the Iranians and Syrians in line and also provided a credible threat to the Saudi Kingdom to ensure their good behavior. Now, they are no longer necessary, since we provide the threat, and eventually an Iraqi Represenative Republic will take our place.
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It seems as if GWs reasons for going to war change daily since no WMDs have been found.The least of which is his own ego.
Sorry Captain, but I think you are way off base on this. His speech, at the outset of the war, mentioned the development of WMD's, as well as very henious human rights violations. Also, you forgot to mention one thing, do you think Libya would have folded if we would have backed-down from Hussein?
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Would any of you guys send one of your loved ones to fight in this war under such shakey circumstances?
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Serjeant-Major Duncan Munro
Capt. Thos. Graham's Coy.
42nd Royal Highland Regiment of Foote
(The Black Sheep of the Black Watch)
"Nemo Me Impune Lacessit"
-Or-
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securemann
Deerslayer
USA
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July 08 2002
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Posted - February 10 2004 : 9:29:47 PM
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| Got to agree with ya Highlander on your post.The U.S.didn't give a fat rat's you know what when Hussein was brutalizing his own in the 80's.Matter of fact we gave him most of the stuff.We want to think that our military are dying for a just cause.People say that Hussein had the WMD'S moved out of the country right at the start of the war.All the detection that we did wouldn't you think that we would have noticed? Bad regimes,brutal regimes and inhumane ones,man we would be all over the place.As I said before,if we follow that logic,we should be in North Korea and China.I'm sorry,I smell oil and nothing but oil over that way and I cringe everytime we lose another soldier.But anyway,we will be there for many years to come trying to keep a U.S.backed government in Iraq while the bombs go off. |
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susquesus
Mad Hermit of the North Woods
USA
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September 03 2003
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Posted - February 11 2004 : 12:04:21 AM
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I'm pretty much with you on this one Highlander. No one can say that Hussein didn't get what he deserved-but do the ends justify the means? As to erroneous information being used to convince the public of the necessity of going to war- absolutely. It was a desperate, last minute, grasping at straws. There were a ton of good reasons to go to war, they just used one that wasn't real. They wanted to present a noble effort to satisfy the UN. They put together a bunch of unrelated, shaky bits of info and said, "Well don't you see?!?", tried to pull an "Emperor's New Clothes" game with us. I'm only sorry that Colin Powell stuck his neck out on this one. They wanted something that implied that Iraq was an imminent threat to the safety of the American public. Didn't have it. A threat to their neighbors, absolutely. To us, not a chance.
I'm not saying that I'm against the war. Hussein was a piece of shi*. He should have been overthrown. Yes, the UN process was long, seemingly unending. It could have worked however. Instead we were told about recent attempts to buy Uranium from Nigér, and implications that Hussein was somehow nebulously involved with the 9/11 attacks. Talk about a cheap shot. We were played. I was played. I believed them.
I still think that the results of the war will be positive and that our troops are performing incredibly under adverse conditions. I wish that we had done it under better circumstances.
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Highlander
Colonial Militia
USA
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February 04 2003
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Posted - February 11 2004 : 12:44:56 AM
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Well Sarge,I can recall that when the Kurds were gassed(some say it was done by the Iranians)the footage was shown on the news shortly thereafter.As for Mohammar Khadaffi,no one has seen or heard from him since the 1980's anyhow.And when the Pan Am flight 800 was blown out of the sky,George Bush senior did nothing.When the civil war in the former Yugoslavia killed thousands of innocents,he still did nothing.Granted, Hussein committed numerous atrocities against his own people,but that was not why we went to war anyhow.
I recall a conversation between two U.S.Diplomats concerning Tacho Somoza,the late dictator of Nicaragua before the revolution there in 1979.
Diplomat #1:"That Somoza is a real S.O.B."
Diplomat #2:"Yes,but he's OUR S.O.B."
Since Saddam was the recipient of copious amounts of U.S.aid in the 1980's(Satellite intel,chemicals,livestock feed,cash grants etc.)One would think that he wasn't such a villain after all. He disclosed to a reporter once,that the U.S. was out to get him when it Iran/Contra broke open.The same can probably be said for Noriega "Pineapple Face" in Panama.
Was this the same C.I.A that dropped the ball on 9/11? If so,then why is George Tenent still on the payroll?If you believe that GW wanted to go after Sadaam anyhow,just to impress his daddy,then the WMDs were only a pretext anyhow.Even the old man was sensible enough to see that a ground war in Iraq would suck this country into a quagmire.
Finally,as a cop you know that one can't take action based on what somebody MIGHT do.It just isn't Constitutional. www.JohnKerry.com |
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SgtMunro
Soldier of the King
USA
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Posted - February 11 2004 : 02:30:14 AM
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Oh, this is getting good, alright time to reload and step back up to the line.
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I'm sorry,I smell oil and nothing but oil over that way...
If that were truly the case; why didn't we just take it back in '91, when we had over a half-million U.S. Soldiers in the theater to do it with, or just buy it from him by vetoing the sanctions through the use of our 'Nuclear Veto' option on the U.N. Security Council?
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Bad regimes,brutal regimes and inhumane ones,man we would be all over the place.
We may just yet, as President Lincoln said during the Civil War, "One war at a time..."
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They wanted to present a noble effort to satisfy the UN.
That really wasn't necessary, since the U.N. Security Council had similar findings back in 1998. The problem was with Secretary General Kofi Annon, who was managing the U.N.'s "Oil For Food" operation, he seen the kickbacks and contracts fluttering away from his greedy little hands and he was not at all pleased.
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They put together a bunch of unrelated, shaky bits of info and said, "Well don't you see?!?", tried to pull an "Emperor's New Clothes" game with us.
Would the "They" in question be the Clinton Administration, The United Nations, The British Foreign Ministry and Inteligence, or is it just President Bush's fault? Yeah, that's got to be it, it's him and Cheeney's boys at Haliburton. No, I am afraid not, there was enough intel from sources outside of our own to confirm our own therories.
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Yes, the UN process was long, seemingly unending.
The key word being "unending", twelve years of sanctions and other U.N.-B.S. was enough.
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and implications that Hussein was somehow nebulously involved with the 9/11 attacks.
Considering our guys have found camps over there, with airplane fuselages and mock building M.O.U.T. (Military Operations Urban Terrain) set-ups, I do not find that at all nebulous. What do you think he was doing, forming his own CT unit like Delta or SEAL-6?
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Was this the same C.I.A that dropped the ball on 9/11? If so,then why is George Tenent still on the payroll?
As I said before, rebuilding the HumInt sources destroyed by two Democratic (Carter & Clinton) Administrations could not happen overnight.
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Finally,as a cop you know that one can't take action based on what somebody MIGHT do.It just isn't Constitutional.
I believe the defintion of "Probable Cause" is reasonable belief, mor |
Serjeant-Major Duncan Munro
Capt. Thos. Graham's Coy.
42nd Royal Highland Regiment of Foote
(The Black Sheep of the Black Watch)
"Nemo Me Impune Lacessit"
-Or-
"Recruit locally, fight globally." |
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securemann
Deerslayer
USA
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Posted - February 11 2004 : 11:37:41 AM
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| There were many times while I worked in violent service that certain individuals were planning to get me.They hid weapons and threatened my life.Nothing could be done until something happened.Now,if I smoked them first before they got me,it would have been bye bye to Securemann.Ya'll get my drift. |
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SgtMunro
Soldier of the King
USA
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Posted - February 11 2004 : 5:14:33 PM
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quote:
There were many times while I worked in violent service that certain individuals were planning to get me.They hid weapons and threatened my life.Nothing could be done until something happened.
Regardless of who those certain individuals were, staff or inmates, the actual crime of 'Terroristic Threats' would have been more than enough to warrant a thorough search of their person and living quarters, as well as everyone elses on the cell block. A friend of mine is a lieutenant of guards at SCI Albion here in Pennsylvania, and that is exactly how they handle any verbal threat against a guard or staff member. If the search would have yielded a weapon or other contraband, additional charges could be levied.
Now, I am aware that you worked in a psychiatric hospital, where you probably had some really bad folks. Even in a hospital setting there is always the onus of liability on the facility management, for not acting on such threats. Such action may involve inspection of his domicile, or notification of the authorities. Failure to do so would have left them open to be 'sued into the fires of hell', so to speak. If you doubt me, just ask any attorney of experience.
Going back to the original subject of this thread, I do believe that 9-11 taught us not to wait for the 'first punch' ever again. What is needed is a little 'worldwide spring cleaning', and unfortunately we are one of the few countries who 'pack the gear' to get the job done.
There are leaders of other countries who say that it is not our place to make such judgements or take such actions. These are the same leaders who let the enemies of civilization, radical Islam, kill their own people, within their own borders. These are countries I would not use as an example of how a free and righteous people should act. The same countries were more than willing to take money, sell illegal arms and look the other way while Saddam continued to build his power through fear and violence. I will say again that those countries are not honorable enough to give us any advice.
The ball is in your court, guys...
Your Most Humble Servant,
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Serjeant-Major Duncan Munro
Capt. Thos. Graham's Coy.
42nd Royal Highland Regiment of Foote
(The Black Sheep of the Black Watch)
"Nemo Me Impune Lacessit"
-Or-
"Recruit locally, fight globally." |
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securemann
Deerslayer
USA
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Posted - February 11 2004 : 6:50:31 PM
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Nah,no suing of the facility.No such animal.You go out on Comp only to come back to get blasted again.You have too many loop holes and b.s. when dealing with mental health especially when you work in mental health and represented by Corrections.Whoops,sorry I'm off topic.
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SgtMunro
Soldier of the King
USA
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Posted - February 11 2004 : 8:07:58 PM
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quote:
Nah,no suing of the facility.No such animal...You have too many loop holes and b.s. when dealing with mental health especially when you work in mental health and represented by Corrections.
I'm sorry, but I find that very hard to believe. No local, county or state institution is impervious to lawsuit, brought forward by current or former employees. The Pennsylvania State Police was sued by a captain, for defamation of character. The San Francisco Police was sued by a group of patrolmen, over the department's antiquated weapons policy. Both lawsuits were won, and damages paid to the plaintifs.
I do not think that a state/county mental health facility is any better insured against civil action brought about by misconduct or poor policy. Said facility is most certianly not immune from liability, for failure to report a criminal act within the confines of the institution. This is the law; and as I have said before, if you doubt me check with an attorney.
It sounds like you needed to talk to an attorney anyways, besides the one which represents your union. I know from experience that union attorneys, which represent govenrnment employees, usually 'work both sides of the fence'. That is to say that while they may represent your union during collective bargaining and greviences, they also do work for the government entity in another department. This supposedly eliminates any appearance of impropriety, "Yeah, right".
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You go out on Comp only to come back to get blasted again.
That temporary remedy is separate from those punitive and compensatory damages which you are entitled to for the facility's misconduct. Apples and oranges, my friend.
Your Most Humble Servant,
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Serjeant-Major Duncan Munro
Capt. Thos. Graham's Coy.
42nd Royal Highland Regiment of Foote
(The Black Sheep of the Black Watch)
"Nemo Me Impune Lacessit"
-Or-
"Recruit locally, fight globally." |
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susquesus
Mad Hermit of the North Woods
USA
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Posted - February 11 2004 : 8:35:52 PM
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quote:
They put together a bunch of unrelated, shaky bits of info and said, "Well don't you see?!?", tried to pull an "Emperor's New Clothes" game with us.
Would the "They" in question be the Clinton Administration, The United Nations, The British Foreign Ministry and Inteligence, or is it just President Bush's fault? Yeah, that's got to be it, it's him and Cheeney's boys at Haliburton. No, I am afraid not, there was enough intel from sources outside of our own to confirm our own therories.
-Sgt. Munro
I would say that it is the fault of the administration. They ultimately decided. Neither the Clinton administration, the UN, or Brit. intelligence made the final decision. When your the boss you've gotta step up to the plate and take responsibility. Blaming mistakes on others is a sign of poor management technique. This administration refuses to take responsibility for anything negative. The common response is that it's the fault of the Clinton administration. Well Boo-Hoo, buck up and show your balls. Bush is running the show now, not Clinton. Playing the blame game is exactly what is going to get this administration voted out of office. People admire those who admit their own faults. |
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Theresa
Bumppo's Tavern Proprietress
USA
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Posted - February 11 2004 : 8:58:24 PM
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| This is probably trivial in comparison to the topic of this discussion. But, let's bring it down to an "at home" situation. If one of our students threatens another, we report it, it is recorded, and disciplinary steps are taken. If we passed it off as "well he/she probably didn't really mean it...you know kids, blah, blah, blah" and something happened to the one threatened, it's back on us. Pre-emptive strike. |
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SgtMunro
Soldier of the King
USA
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Posted - February 11 2004 : 11:07:38 PM
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quote:
I would say that it is the fault of the administration. They ultimately decided. Neither the Clinton administration, the UN, or Brit. intelligence made the final decision. When your the boss you've gotta step up to the plate and take responsibility. Blaming mistakes on others is a sign of poor management technique. This administration refuses to take responsibility for anything negative.
No Susquesus, you are completely wrong on this. The Clinton Administration conducted numerous airstrikes against Iraq during those eight years. But I guess that half-assed minimal attacks are okay by your standards, just as long as we don't try to go all the way. Both caused loss of life, the only difference was that the Bush Doctrine was light-years more sucessful.
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The common response is that it's the fault of the Clinton administration.
In this case, it is. As it was with him dropping the ball on collecting Bin Laden from the Sudanese in 1998. Check your history...
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Bush is running the show now, not Clinton.
And thank God for that. Clinton response to the 9-11 attacks would have minimal, unless of course he needed to divert attention from his extracuricular activities.
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Playing the blame game is exactly what is going to get this administration voted out of office. People admire those who admit their own faults.
Perhaps you should direct that comment to the Democratic Party, they fired the opening salvoes back in 2002, with their B.S. mantra, "What did the president know, and when did he know it?"
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Well Boo-Hoo, buck up and your show your balls.
Interesting comment from one who does not know me that well. Well, I have 'been there and done that', and have an interesting collection of commendations for valor to prove it, both from my wartime service and subsequent police career. Tell me son, in your 26 years, when have you ever 'stepped up to the plate'?
Your Most Humble Servant,
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Serjeant-Major Duncan Munro
Capt. Thos. Graham's Coy.
42nd Royal Highland Regiment of Foote
(The Black Sheep of the Black Watch)
"Nemo Me Impune Lacessit"
-Or-
"Recruit locally, fight globally." |
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Highlander
Colonial Militia
USA
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Posted - February 12 2004 : 01:49:00 AM
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I still don't get what Sadaam did to U.S. that deserved in invasion.While Iran was linked to the Kobar Towers bombing in 1996,and Syria was linked to the bombing of the LaBelle Disco bombing in Berlin in 1986,the U.S. did nothing to Iran,and bombed Libya subsequently(eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeerrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr where's the baby's room!?).Again,Sadaam was a defanged tiger after Desert Storm.While he may have been a threat to Israel,he was no threat to U.S.So does this justify the deaths of 532 Americans plus the spending of billions of dollars that could have been used in this country?
Incidentally,I will bet money that this war has created more terrorists now,than were actually there to begin with. |
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susquesus
Mad Hermit of the North Woods
USA
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Posted - February 12 2004 : 01:55:06 AM
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quote:
Well Boo-Hoo, buck up and show your balls.
Interesting comment from one who does not know me that well. Well, I have 'been there and done that', and have an interesting collection of commendations for valor to prove it, both from my wartime service and subsequent police career. Tell me son, in your 26 years, when have you ever 'stepped up to the plate'?
-Sgt. Munro
I think you took that the wrong way. I was referring to Bush and the Administration. I believe that taking responsibility for what takes place on your watch is an essential element of leadership. I liked Truman's attitude -"The buck stops here." It seems that there's a lack of sense of responsibility in the White House recently.
Also, I would never get personal in a political discussion. I don't know you, all I know about you is what I see here. I didn't realize that you would construe my call for the administration to show courage as an attack aimed at you. I haven't served in the military or worked in public safety, if that means that I haven't "stepped up to the plate" I guess I haven't. |
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Kurt
Mohicanite
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Posted - February 12 2004 : 06:21:52 AM
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One of the key tactics of the Conservatives is to rephase the question into a self-serving personal attack. This prevents the necessity of answering the original question (which would be "unflattering" for the Conservative).
Watch this:
Habeus Corpus is unAmerican! Due Process is a god damned pinko plot to destroy America!
NOONE will displute these claims! |
Yr. obt. svt.
Kurt |
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SgtMunro
Soldier of the King
USA
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Posted - February 12 2004 : 06:34:26 AM
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quote:
One of the key tactics of the Conservatives is to rephase the question into a self-serving personal attack.
This reminds me of a favorite quote of mine from Jim Quinn; that being, "If you want to know what Liberals are up to, just listen to what they are accusing you of."
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Serjeant-Major Duncan Munro
Capt. Thos. Graham's Coy.
42nd Royal Highland Regiment of Foote
(The Black Sheep of the Black Watch)
"Nemo Me Impune Lacessit"
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"Recruit locally, fight globally." |
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Theresa
Bumppo's Tavern Proprietress
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Posted - February 12 2004 : 07:35:34 AM
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What Hussein did here was comparable to the Nazis. Oil is not the root of the war with Iraq we have plenty and the prices were fairly stable. It does not matter that we have found no evidence of WMD, but he was trying to pursue them and if he would use Nerve and mustard agents on his own people, why in the world would he hesitate to use them against anyone else to include the US. In the end, it will all be justified, but Americans want undeniable hard evidence. How many killers are convicted in the US on circumstantial evidence? A lot!!! Maybe if our court systems had been better the guy that killed the 11 YO would have been in Jail and she would be alive, but the judge had asked for more documentation. If Clinton had not sold our country for campaign contributions, CHina would not now have a rocket that can reach the US. Had the liberal administration not botched the Ye Lee or whatever his name is investigation, then he as well would be in jail. Remember 16 Jet Fighters have been found buried in the sand and if it took 5 months to find those then how long would it take you to find an artillery shell. We still have not lost as many as we did on 11 sep 01 and if we don't press the fight and take it to them, another grand attack will occur and the only reason it hasn't yet is we have them on the run.
Terroirsts only know one thing FORCE. They are runnning scared and attack innocent people. Look at how hussein was hiding in a hole when found. You are extremely lucky to have the freedom to express the incoherent garble that comes from your mouth. Disagree with Hussein and you were executed. People that think like you are the kind of people that got McAurthur fired and the big reason the country in in the mess it is now. We tried your way for 50 years and it doesnt work. Go read a BOOK and let the men finish the work we started this time.
From a soldier in Iraq
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Theresa |
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SgtMunro
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Posted - February 12 2004 : 07:48:04 AM
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Excellent post, Theresa, and very timely. The old Sarge was starting to feel surrounded and cut-off. Of course my small unit tactics training, from many moons ago, dictates; when surrounded and/or ambushed you do the unexpected, counter-attack. You understand all to well what this is all about, like me you know that there is both good and evil in the world and that all evil needs to win is for the good to do nothing.
We must carry this mission out, and we must succeed, because failure could herald our demise and therefore is not an option. This is not the time for another leader who looks to the U.N. and "Old Europe" for permission to take half-hearted measures.
Your Most Humble Servant,
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Serjeant-Major Duncan Munro
Capt. Thos. Graham's Coy.
42nd Royal Highland Regiment of Foote
(The Black Sheep of the Black Watch)
"Nemo Me Impune Lacessit"
-Or-
"Recruit locally, fight globally." |
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Kurt
Mohicanite
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Posted - February 12 2004 : 07:57:20 AM
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The ends justify the means. Sadam had to go.
It is vital to demonize your opponent because noone ever work up screaming after killing a demon.
Everyone who works for the UN is a liar and a thief!
Anyone who speaks against a President is UnAmerican!
Why take the heat if you can blame Clinton? |
Yr. obt. svt.
Kurt |
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Seamus
Guardian of Heaven's Gate
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Posted - February 12 2004 : 08:06:59 AM
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Amen, Duncan.......amen.
And never fear, your flanks and back are protected......my silence does not mean I am not with you, simply covering you from surprises!
Carry on, Lad! |
Life's journey is not to
arrive at the grave safely
in a well preserved body,
but rather to skid in sideways,
totally worn out, shouting
'...holy sh*t ...what a ride!'
~~Mavis Leyrer, Seattle
Seamus
~~Aim small, hit the b*****d right between the eyes!~~ |
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securemann
Deerslayer
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Posted - February 12 2004 : 10:42:43 AM
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| Does anyone really think that the U.S. backed government which is scheduled to be implemented in June will last? Like Vietnam,we are stuck there for now.When the day comes when our troops can leave Iraq in honor with a new "Free" Iraqi government in place,will it last? I'm afraid that history will repeat itself like 1975 Saigon and Iraq will fall under again and we suffer loss for nothing once again.Otherwise,we just stay in Iraq forever and watch our soldiers get ambushed on a daily basis. |
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Gadget Girl
Gatherer of Gathering Gadgets
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Posted - February 12 2004 : 12:03:14 PM
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The thing that worries me most about the War in Irag is that it may not be about Bush's integrity, or WMDs, or oil, or even terrorists...but how much of it is about the "machine" around the President, the defense chain of Cheney - Rumsfield - Wolfowitz. Is Wolfowitz the heir apparent after Rumsfield (YIKES!)? This has transcended administrations, liberal and conservative. It seems to be about a strategy that seeks to control the future of stronger nations (like China) not even in the Middle East, and its working and at a great expense. Is anybody else the least bit concerned about the additional motives that WEREN'T so obvious?
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SgtMunro
Soldier of the King
USA
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Posted - February 12 2004 : 1:15:20 PM
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And never fear, your flanks and back are protected......my silence does not mean I am not with you, simply covering you from surprises!
Thank you Seamus, it is good to know a veteran 'woods warrior' is watching my six.
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Does anyone really think that the U.S. backed government which is scheduled to be implemented in June will last? Like Vietnam,we are stuck there for now.When the day comes when our troops can leave Iraq in honor with a new "Free" Iraqi government in place,will it last?
Timetables are always flexible in these situations. As for the Vietnam comparison, there is none. Maybe in another 10 years or so you could make such a statement, but not when we are only at the 11 month mark could you come to such a conclusion using logic. As to the question "Will it last?", I am willing to give the Iraqi people a little more credit in how they will manage their independence. It's not time yet to blow the dust off of the old Bob Dylan L/P's...
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It seems to be about a strategy that seeks to control the future of stronger nations (like China) not even in the Middle East, and its working and at a great expense.
I don't know if its about controlling the future of nations like China, but certainly controling their influence. We are behind the eight ball, as far as China goes, thanks to eight years of intellegence and weapon tecnology being handed to them in exchange for boatloads of cash being dumped into the Clinton and DNC war-chests. Using 'straw men' like Moktar Riyahdi of the Indonesian Lippo Group and Charlie Tree with his Chinese Government and Triad (The original Mafia) connections to facilitate the deals through the commerce department (Thereby avoiding congressional oversight). Unfortunately we need to spend a lot to put a crimp in the threat from the east.
...And to answer a question I didn't get to earlier
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Incidentally,I will bet money that this war has created more terrorists now,than were actually there to begin with.
Negative Captain, it is concentrating them in Iraq, but it is certainly not creating more. As a cop, I would rather those animals not be here, in the U.S., hurting our innocent men, women and children, especially my children. I like the idea of them being drawn over to Iraq instead, where the Americans they face are the highly trained, equipt and motivated soldiers, sailors, airmen and marines of our armed forces. If you remember from our mutual friend over there, we are killing them by the bushel, and they are starting to feel the pinch.
Your Most Humble Servant,
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Serjeant-Major Duncan Munro
Capt. Thos. Graham's Coy.
42nd Royal Highland Regiment of Foote
(The Black Sheep of the Black Watch)
"Nemo Me Impune Lacessit"
-Or-
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Highlander
Colonial Militia
USA
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Posted - February 12 2004 : 5:27:46 PM
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Originally posted by Theresa
What Hussein did here was comparable to the Nazis. Oil is not the root of the war with Iraq we have plenty and the prices were fairly stable. It does not matter that we have found no evidence of WMD, but he was trying to pursue them and if he would use Nerve and mustard agents on his own people, why in the world would he hesitate to use them against anyone else to include the US. In the end, it will all be justified, but Americans want undeniable hard evidence. How many killers are convicted in the US on circumstantial evidence? A lot!!! Maybe if our court systems had been better the guy that killed the 11 YO would have been in Jail and she would be alive, but the judge had asked for more documentation. If Clinton had not sold our country for campaign contributions, CHina would not now have a rocket that can reach the US. Had the liberal administration not botched the Ye Lee or whatever his name is investigation, then he as well would be in jail. Remember 16 Jet Fighters have been found buried in the sand and if it took 5 months to find those then how long would it take you to find an artillery shell. We still have not lost as many as we did on 11 sep 01 and if we don't press the fight and take it to them, another grand attack will occur and the only reason it hasn't yet is we have them on the run.
Terroirsts only know one thing FORCE. They are runnning scared and attack innocent people. Look at how hussein was hiding in a hole when found. You are extremely lucky to have the freedom to express the incoherent garble that comes from your mouth. Disagree with Hussein and you were executed. People that think like you are the kind of people that got McAurthur fired and the big reason the country in in the mess it is now. We tried your way for 50 years and it doesnt work. Go read a BOOK and let the men finish the work we started this time.
From a soldier in Iraq
And what is it that Hussein did here again?Actually he studied Joseph Stalin who never seems to get the credit for the 20 million people that he murdered.But then again, Uncle Joe was our "ally" during the Big One remember? So its o.k.then.
Theresa you have no idea about what you are talking about here.There are no links to Sadaam & 9/11.GW said so himself.Osaama & Sadaam have always been ideologically opposed to each other.If you are up on current events,a letter that was intercepted from an Al-Quaida operative last week indicates that they are NOT getting the Iraqi volunteers that they need to sustain operations there.So much for the myth that Iraq is the "frontline in the war on terror". Furthermore,Al-Quaida did not focus on Iraq until Oct.2003.Now that the Baathists are killing Iraqis,Osama is probably having second thoughts about his commitment there since killing fellow muslims does not exactly enhance his image in the Arab world.You have been to the Middle East right?Otherwise,you should get your information from other sources besides O'Reilly.Oh,tell your friend that he should really take advantage of that G.I.Bill.It might actually bring him up to speed.
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Highlander
Colonial Militia
USA
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Posted - February 12 2004 : 5:42:55 PM
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I like the idea of them being drawn over to Iraq instead, where the Americans they face are the highly trained, equipt and motivated soldiers, sailors, airmen and marines of our armed forces. If you remember from our mutual friend over there, we are killing them by the bushel, and they are starting to feel the pinch.
There is nothing that restricts them to Iraq.It is a nice thought,but you've bought the party line too apparently.It is only a matter of time before they get here.Nice to hear that we're killing them in droves,however its not like they invaded New Jersey(which wouldn't be a bad idea by the way) Ever hear of a blood fued?The Ugly Americanism that was created will only create more people who will want a little payback.The same happened in Vietnam,and they only wanted us out of their country.You may then have to deal with them wether you want to or not.
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The War In Iraq
